2 Penn State Officials Held For Trial Following Sex Abuse Hearing

By Tony Romeo and Oren Liebermann

HARRISBURG, Pa. (CBS/AP) – A Penn State assistant football coach testified Friday that he believes he saw former assistant coach Jerry Sandusky molesting a boy on campus and that he fully conveyed what he had seen to two Penn State administrators.

Mike McQueary, speaking for the first time in public about the 2002 encounter in a Penn State locker room, said he believes that Sandusky was attacking the child with his hands around the boy’s waist but said he wasn’t 100 percent sure it was intercourse.

McQueary took the stand Friday morning in a Pennsylvania courtroom during a preliminary hearing for university officials Tim Curley and Gary Schultz, who are accused of lying to a grand jury about what McQueary told them.

At the conclusion of the hearing, District Judge William C. Wenner ruled that prosecutors have enough evidence to send their cases to trial.

McQueary’s story is central to the case against Curley and Schultz. They testified to the grand jury that McQueary never relayed the seriousness of what he saw. The officials, and Penn State coach Joe Paterno, have been criticized for never telling police about the 2002 allegation. Prosecutors say Sandusky continued to abuse boys for six more years.

The lawyers for Curley and Schultz say the men are innocent and that uncorroborated testimony from McQueary is not enough on which to hang the case. Curley and Schultz told the grand jury that they remembered McQueary reporting only something inappropriate, like wrestling, but nothing as serious as rape.

McQueary, who was on the stand for about two hours Friday, said he had stopped by a campus football locker room to drop off a pair of sneakers in the spring of 2002 when he heard slapping sounds in a shower and happened upon Sandusky and the boy.

He said Sandusky was behind the boy he estimated to be 10 or 12 years old, with his hands wrapped around the youngster’s waist. He said the boy was facing a wall, with his hands on it.

McQueary, 37, said he has never described what he saw as anal rape or anal intercourse and couldn’t see Sandusky’s genitals, but that “it was very clear that it looked like there was intercourse going on.”

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In its report last month, the grand jury summarized McQueary’s testimony as saying he “saw a naked boy … with his hands up against the wall, being subjected to anal intercourse by a naked Sandusky.”

Under cross examination by an attorney for Curley, McQueary reiterated that he had not seen Sandusky penetrating or fondling the boy but was nearly certain they were having intercourse because the two were standing so close and Sandusky’s arms were wrapped around the youth.

He said he peeked into the shower three times — the first via a mirror, the other two times directly. The last time he looked in, Sandusky and the boy had separated, he said. He said he didn’t say anything, but “I know they saw me. They looked directly in my eye, both of them.”

McQueary said the entire encounter — from when he first entered the locker room to when he retreated to his office — lasted about 45 seconds.

McQueary said he reported what he saw to Paterno but never went to police.

He said he did not give Paterno explicit details of what he believed he’d seen, saying he wouldn’t have used terms like sodomy or anal intercourse out of respect for the longtime coach.

Paterno told the grand jury that McQueary reported seeing Sandusky doing something of a “sexual nature” with the youngster but that he didn’t press for details.

“I didn’t push Mike … because he was very upset,” Paterno said. “I knew Mike was upset, and I knew some kind of inappropriate action was being taken by Jerry Sandusky with a youngster.”

McQueary said Paterno told him he’d “done the right thing” by reporting the encounter. The head coach appeared shocked and saddened and slumped back in his chair, McQueary said.

Paterno told McQueary he would talk to others about what he’d reported.

Nine or 10 days later, McQueary said he met with Curley and Schultz and told them he’d seen Sandusky and a boy, both naked, in the shower after hearing skin-on-skin slapping sounds.

“I told them that I saw Jerry in the showers with a young boy and that what I had seen was extremely sexual and over the lines and it was wrong,” McQueary said. “I would have described that it was extremely sexual and I thought that some kind of intercourse was going on.”

McQueary said he was left with the impression both men took his report seriously. When asked why he didn’t go to police, he referenced Schultz’s position as a vice president at the university who had overseen the campus police

“I thought I was talking to the head of the police, to be frank with you,” he said. “In my mind it was like speaking to a (district attorney). It was someone who police reported to and would know what to do with it.”

Curley told the grand jury that he couldn’t recall his specific conversation with McQueary, but that McQueary never reported seeing anal intercourse or other sexual conduct. He said he recalled McQueary reporting wrestling or “horsing around.”

Schultz said he remembered McQueary and Paterno describing what the younger coach saw only in a very general way.

“I had the impression it was inappropriate,” Schultz told the grand jury. “I had the feeling it was some king of wrestling activity and maybe Jerry might have grabbed a young boys genitals.”

Under cross-examination, McQueary said he considered what he saw a crime but didn’t call police because “it was delicate in nature.”

“I tried to use my best judgment,” he said. “I was sure the act was over.” He said he never tried to find the boy.

Paterno, Schultz and Curley didn’t testify, but Judge Wenner read their grand jury testimony from January in weighing the case.

Curley’s attorney, Caroline Roberto, said prosecutors “will never be able to reach their burden proof at a trial.”

Schultz’s attorney, Tom Farrell, predicted his client would be acquitted.

He also took a shot at Paterno, saying, “I’m an Italian from Brooklyn, and he may not have called the police but he may have done what I would have done, which is get the boys in the car with a few baseball bats and crowbars and take it to the fellow.”

Sandusky says he is innocent of more than 50 charges stemming from what authorities say were sexual assaults over 12 years on 10 boys in his home, on Penn State property and elsewhere. The scandal has provoked strong criticism that Penn State officials didn’t do enough to stop Sandusky, and prompted the departures of Paterno and the school’s longtime president, Graham Spanier.

Curley, 57, Penn State’s athletic director, was placed on leave by the university after his arrest. Schultz, 62, returned to retirement after spending about four decades at the school, most recently as senior vice president for business and finance, and treasurer.

Tell us what you think, share your thoughts below.

(TM and © Copyright 2011 CBS Radio Inc. and its relevant subsidiaries. CBS RADIO and EYE Logo TM and Copyright 2010 CBS Broadcasting Inc. Used under license. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed. The Associated Press contributed to this report.)

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  • lijingjing

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  • grumpy

    Something about this whole fiasco smells rotten! The harshest actions have been taken against a person who:
    A) Wasn’t in the locker room.
    B) Wasn’t with any of the abused children.
    C) Followed procedure by informing his superiors.
    Could it be that these superiors were the same people that have been wanting to replace Joe Paterno since 2005? There are more questions than answers as to why the Coach has been the fall guy!
    P.S. I do not know any of the involved. I’m going on what I have read and heard on this unfortunate incident of child abuse by one disgusting, sick, individual. A “gag” order should be issued by this Judge until the facts of the trial are presented. No wonder “victims” are reluctant to come forward. This case has become a media circus!………….. Just the FACTS please.

  • noname

    Sandusky had connections, resources, was a loud mouth pushy type and nobody would listen that a guy of his community stature would do something like this. same as nobody will take seriously and won’t listen to the ongoing case about the toddler who’s being abused now, because the abuser is a bank officer and the person protecting them is conencted with the courts. btw..the toddler is old enough to speak – after telling what happened is now being told to shut up or else. courts released the child back to the care of what would be the equivliant of McQuery’s role in this.

  • george

    has anybody noticed that Sandusky only went after boys who had no father present… i am from west Philadelphia… trust me when i tell you that no father who was around when i grew up would have allowed this man to walk the earth… even if it was not their child… in my neighborhood fathers took care of all the children, all the time…. Sandusky is just playing for time now… he knows that Penn State will get him out of this…

  • Beve4rly Hills

    McQueary is a joke. What if it’d been his child. E-V-E-R-Y-B-O-D-Y has a moral responsibility to his fellow man. McQueary’s soul will never let him have peace. How does his wife sleep next to a man like him.

  • Mother Nature

    Billy Penn…… ON THE MARK!

  • BillyPenn

    I detest McQueary for what he didn’t do, not for what he said. The moment he saw the activity that was taking place he should have stepped in and stopped it. His outrage at what was going on should have risen above any intimidation fear as to the individual involved. If I was in his shoes and saw what he states he saw, I would have put a stop to it immediately. No matter who was involved. I feel that McQueary is just as guilty as Sandusky in that he failed to put a stop to crime and allow it to continue and he should have notified the police immediatley. If he didn’t trust the campus police, he should have called the State Police and said’ ” I just knocked a guy out for attacking a child’. That’s what I would have done. I dare anyone to say that fear of losing their job is more important than saving a kid from a pervert !

    • Peter

      And his failure to act gives Sandusky’s lawyers an opening to argue that maybe nothing illegal happened since it apparently wasn’t bad enough to make McQueary do something. Sandusky may walk on some of the charges thanks to him.

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